Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Object of the Week - July 8th, 2018 M 17 - The Swan Nebula

  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    184

    Object of the Week - July 8th, 2018 M 17 - The Swan Nebula

    M17

    NGC 6618
    Sh 2-45

    R.A.: 18h20m48.0s
    Dec.: -16°11'00"

    Size 11.0'
    Mag: 6

    Somewhat to my surprise M17 has never been covered in the OOTW before so here is its chance. First discovered by Philippe Loys de Cheseaux in 1746 M17 was
    independently rediscovered by Messier in 1764, de Cheseaux apparently never published his observation.so Messier did not know about it. De Cheseaux observed from near Lausanne in Switzerland and used a referactor of 4.2m FL and a 60cm FL Gregorian reflector. Unfortunately De Cheseaux suffered from ill health and died at 33 or he might have been better known.
    The nebula has many nick names including the Swan nebula, the Omega nebula, the Checkmark nebula, the Horseshoe nebula and the Lobster nebula.
    I prefer the Swan nebula nickname as it reminds me of the Swan from Sibelius epic tone poem the Swan of Tuonela which glides on the dark river round the
    isle of the dead (somewhat morbid I guess). It was John Herschel with his classical bent that gave it the name the Omega nebula and the Swan nickname
    was apparently first coined by George Chambers in his 1889 Celestial Handbook. Easily visible in a small telescope and by naked eye from dark southern
    locations M17 is an HII region and cluster lying about 5500 light years away and the core of the nebula spans about 15 light years across. The star cluster (also known as NGC 6618)
    contains maybe 35 hot young stars. There are however as many as 800 stars in the centre of the nebula. It is not clear if star formation is still active in the region or recently finished.
    M17 is a blister nebula on the side of a massive molecular cloud, not dissimilar to the Orion nebula, to which William Herschel with much prescience compared it. Right from the start there were many historical drawings of M17, some of which even look like the nebula 😊 There is an interesting historical article by Holden on this at https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Popul...in_Sagittarius. Unfortunately from my northern
    location M17 never rises that high, in fact never really gets above 25 degrees altitude so I never get the best views. Perhaps not surprisingly under these
    conditions I find that a UHC or even an OIII filter will enhance the views. It does not help either that when M17 is at its highest it never really gets dark
    up here either. It is however one of my favourite nebulae. The challenges here are not to see the main nebulae but the large amounts of nebulosity around it.
    As well as the main nebula there are two other IC nebulae here (IC 4706 and 4707) discovered by Barnard with a 10” refractor but he appears to have given
    Dreyer the wrong positions. He did say he saw two stars involved with nebulosity here which appears, according to Corwin, to be correct if we assume that
    what he saw are the stars BD -16 4811 and -16 4812.They are both part of the same nebula so perhaps we should lose the IC 4707 designation and call the
    whole thing IC 4706. In the classic Victorian observing guides by Smyth and Webb M17 appears in the constellation of Clypeus Sobieski (now Scutum) rather
    than Sagittarius. Both the Herschels did spend quite a lot of time observing it from the UK.

    Omega-Nebula-Herschel.jpg


    Herschel's first drawing of M17

    Messier-17-Lassell.jpg

    Lassells's drawing of M17. It is unclear to me whether these drawings were done by Lassell or his daughter Caroline as she certainly made at least one attributed to him.

    Omega-Nebula-Trouvelot.jpg

    M17 by Trouvelout using the 26" Refractor at USNO.

    eso1537a.jpg

    ESO image of M17 with the 2.2m

  2. #2
    Member Raul Leon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Tampa Florida
    Posts
    190
    Messier 17 is definitely one of my favorite objects, mixture of bright and dark nebulosity that forms a celestial waterfowl never disappoints. OIII filter and NPB filters were used for contrast. 10mm Ethos at 158x magnification with my 14.5 f/4.3 Starstructure DobScan0690.jpg
    Raul Leon
    14.5 Starstructure Dobsonian f/4.3

    http://thestarsketcher.blogspot.com/

  3. #3
    Hi All,

    My observations of M 17 have allways been conducted from south of France, that is to say at about 25° of altitude,
    With a 80 mm scope, the surrounding nebulosities are not seen

    M 17 L80 BL 2001 06 19 iso.jpg



    With a 10" scope (LX200), some nebulosties can be seen just around the back bone of the swan

    M 17 T254 BL 26 07 1998.jpg


    M 17 becomes an astonishing complex of more or less bright and dark areas with my 25" Obsession. But what is intresting is that, with this aperture, the red od the Halpha appears in the farthest parts of the nebulosities, nevertheless weak but steadily.

    M 17 T635 BL 2014 06 27.jpg


    Clear skies
    Bertrand
    http://www.deepsky-drawings.com/dsdlang/en/

  4. #4
    Member Ivan Maly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    537
    Drawing a composite of 8, 13, and 40 mm with OIII filter in 16" F/4.5, SQM 21.3 overhead, 21.1 in the area. My notes say the details are the same without a filter. The "swan" is the pointillist area on right (west).


  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2017
    Location
    Madrid, spain
    Posts
    21
    I like this object, was the first to make a sketch with the new telescope a year ago. The details with more opening are remarkable.

    Messier 17 procesado con gimp.jpg

    Regards.
    http://dibujodelcielonocturno.blogspot.com

    16'' F/4
    Refractor 4'' AP Traveler az DM4

  6. #6
    Member Howard B's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Scappoose, Oregon USA
    Posts
    572
    M17 is one of my favorite objects, and here's my sketch from a few years ago:

    M17_b_crop_invert.jpg

    This is my sketch of M17 as seen through my 28-inch f/4 scope from the Oregon Star Party, but I think it looks much the same in smaller telescopes - which is part of its charm. The historical sketches are fascinating, and show a progression from impression toward realism - which before the advent of astrophotography show a lot more variation than our sketches do today.
    Howard
    30-inch f/2.7 alt-az Newtonian
    https://sites.google.com/site/howardbanichhomepage/
    https://sites.google.com/site/sprays...pemirrors/home
    Contributing Editor, Sky & Telescope magazine

  7. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    La Serena, Chile
    Posts
    429
    Howard, that is a spectaculair sketch. I first thought I saw a picture...

  8. #8
    Member Howard B's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Scappoose, Oregon USA
    Posts
    572
    Thank you!
    Howard
    30-inch f/2.7 alt-az Newtonian
    https://sites.google.com/site/howardbanichhomepage/
    https://sites.google.com/site/sprays...pemirrors/home
    Contributing Editor, Sky & Telescope magazine

  9. #9
    Member RolandosCY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Mosfiloti, Cyprus
    Posts
    186
    Howard, I am speechless at your incredible sketch. W O W ! ! !
    The Darker the Better!
    -------------------------
    18" f4.5 Obsession Classic #1934
    10" f5 Skyatcher Dob
    152mm f5.9 Teleskop Service
    Takahashi FS128
    SkyWatcher 120 f5
    Takahashi FS102
    Takahashi FSQ106N
    SkyWatcher ED80 Pro
    SkyWatcher ED72 Evostar
    Televue Naglers and Ethos

  10. #10
    Member kisspeter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Kerepes, Hungary
    Posts
    88
    Incredible drawings above! Really, hats off to all of you.
    Howard, how big is your drawing on paper (in inches / centimeters)?

    I have only a very old and not so great 4.3" drawing from 1999. It would be time to revisit this beauty.
    m17_kisspeter.jpg
    m17_positive_kisspeter.jpg
    Peter Kiss
    deepeye.hu
    Hungary

  11. #11
    Member Howard B's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Scappoose, Oregon USA
    Posts
    572
    Hi Peter,

    The paper is 11x14 inches / 28x35 cm and the drawing is about 6 inches / 15 cm in diameter - I cropped the page to better feature the nebula. Thanks, and I agree, many fine drawing here!
    Howard
    30-inch f/2.7 alt-az Newtonian
    https://sites.google.com/site/howardbanichhomepage/
    https://sites.google.com/site/sprays...pemirrors/home
    Contributing Editor, Sky & Telescope magazine

  12. #12
    Member kisspeter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Kerepes, Hungary
    Posts
    88
    Thanks, Howard.
    Peter Kiss
    deepeye.hu
    Hungary

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •